tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post8155876244458086956..comments2024-03-24T15:07:18.773+01:00Comments on The Stuttering Brain: How good is Hollins?Tom Weidighttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02084153394215001999noreply@blogger.comBlogger47125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post-76293865910302583482022-04-10T03:11:05.159+02:002022-04-10T03:11:05.159+02:00I attended HCRI in the mid 1980s. I was a severe s...I attended HCRI in the mid 1980s. I was a severe stutterer with the secondary characteristics of head jerks and the occasional slap to the head when really stuck. I believe that there was only 1 stutterer worse than myself in our class of 12 if I remember correctly. I achieved pretty good fluency by graduation and maintained it for several months before the inevitable regression. I really had to crack down and practice and all of my friends were fine with my new way of speaking after I explained the system to them. I think they were just really tired of me making stupid noises and struggling in vain to say my name.I was able to salvage my fluency in about a month with a lot of work. About a year after graduation I attended a refresher week with my instructor Cliff Goldman at his residence on the west coast. That was a big help because he helped me adapt to my new life with lessons on how to regain and maintain my fluency even in critical times of stress and the occasional stuttering episode. I now find myself reverting subconsciously to breathing and gentle onset when I’m stressed or anticipate stuttering. Well to wrap this up, after I got out of the army, I became a pilot in 1994. I still maintain somewhere around a 98 percent fluency rate and some days it’s higher than that. I still practice on long drives or boring flights when I’m not talking on the radio. I can even address the occasional group of people without wanting to die. HCRI did change my life and I hate to see the struggles here in the comments,but don’t give up. If I can talk anyone can. It’s hard work but I can’t imagine going back to my pre course rating of somewhere around 10 to 20 percent fluent.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12020226539712341943noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post-45335282710762705662020-06-29T16:29:02.098+02:002020-06-29T16:29:02.098+02:00What was your original rate of disfluency? Can you...What was your original rate of disfluency? Can you share with us how you practice?Lil Herbiehttp://www.lilherbie.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post-39241820596624037232019-01-22T18:31:54.806+01:002019-01-22T18:31:54.806+01:00Hello,
I read about the Hollins speech therapy cou...Hello,<br />I read about the Hollins speech therapy course and would really like to join it.<br />However I really cannot afford it being in India. Hence requesting anyone if they can share any learning material from this course with me.<br />I do have a stutter and<br />I really need your help in this endeavour of mine as it will help me get back my son and wife who were taken away from me by my in-laws because of this. <br /><br />Hence please let me know if anyone could help me with this.<br />Your cooperation in my fight will be greatly appreciated.<br /><br />Thank you very much.<br /><br />Warmest wishes of the New Year.<br /><br />Sujay Joseph<br />New Delhi, India.s jhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09623491905152401786noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post-40914256967194876772017-06-06T00:12:45.549+02:002017-06-06T00:12:45.549+02:00I attended three Hollins-based fluency-shaping pro...I attended three Hollins-based fluency-shaping programs from the late 1980s through the late 1990s, including a refresher weekend at Hollins itself. My usual level of disfluency is severe. By the end of all three programs, I reached a normal level of fluency within the clinic, which carried over to my family and close friends outside for 1-2 months. I would practice at least 1 hour per day, every day, often much more. My practice included making cold calls to restaurants and stores to ask closing times, etc.<br /><br />After leaving the clinic, my fluency gradually disappeared, as the pressures of normal life outside the protected environment of the clinic took over. With my severe level of disfluency, I found I needed to maintain fanatical attention to the mechanics of my speech, which made spontaneous, communicative talk impossible. Also, to maintain my "targets" in everyday, stressful situations--talking on the phone at work, ordering out, etc.--I had to speak in such an exaggerated, slow way that my "fluent" speech became more disabling and disfiguring than my stutter. (At least when I block, people understand what's happening. When you're trying to order coffee while speaking at 0.5-seconds per syllable, people think you're insane.)<br /><br />In each program, there were patients who had what I would characterize as mild stutters, more of a cosmetic issue for them than a disability. Not surprisingly, they were the ones who seemed to benefit the most from the therapy.<br /><br />Lastly, I also noticed a guilt-tripping tendency on the part of clinicians at all three programs, very much in the tenor of the comment by the graduate student above: basically, if fluency-shaping wasn't working for you, it was because you weren't practicing hard enough, not because anything was inherently wrong with the program. It took me a long time to get over this scarring, which by far was the worst aspect of the programs.<br /><br />Basically, if you get to adulthood and you have severe stutter, you're always going to have it. This does NOT mean that you can't live a hugely fulfilling and successful life--something I realized once I stopped throwing money at these snake-oil schemes and started to accept myself for what I was, warts and all.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post-18643853938432139642016-08-01T20:03:09.144+02:002016-08-01T20:03:09.144+02:00It is stated on the website that Dr. Webster is a ...It is stated on the website that Dr. Webster is a psychologist. Are all of his facilitating clinicians ASHA certified speech language pathologists? <br /><br />M <br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post-54104907811834071592016-07-01T05:18:11.388+02:002016-07-01T05:18:11.388+02:00My son attended the HCRI program eleven years ago ...My son attended the HCRI program eleven years ago at the age of 16. We saw no real improvement in his speech during or after the program.<br /><br />Please understand that I'm not a student working on a fellowship or a therapist of any kind - I'm just a single mom who gave up every creature comfort and many creature necessities to send her child to a place she couldn't afford to do what no one else said could be done. If you think for one second that my son did not keep up with his maintenance plan, you are wrong. Our investment was too great for that. I'm glad that it worked for some (initially) but I can definitely say it did not work for my family. His results were negligible. Do not be fooled. If you can't afford to throw away money, find another program that will focus on the whole person AND tailor a program suited to individual needs.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post-45361904362827977202016-04-21T17:32:32.885+02:002016-04-21T17:32:32.885+02:00Just a very short comment on the effectiveness of ...Just a very short comment on the effectiveness of HCRI. First of all, there are independent journal articles that have shown the efficacy of HCRI's methodology.<br /><br />Secondly as a graduate student in the mid-1990's, I worked at HCRI on a fellowship. One of my duties was to do the statistical analysis for one of their follow-up studies. What I found based on blindly rated fluency scores taken from subject recordings pre, post-therapy and two to four years later. was that immediately following therapy the vast majority of subjects were in the normal fluency ranges (>95%). The majority of subject maintained that fluency two years later. Whether the person maintained fluency appeared to be related to the amount they practiced in order to maintain fluency levels. <br /><br />I suspect that with many who complained about the therapy not working, neglect to keep up with their specific maintenance issues and plans, and not practicing fluency.Larry C. Lyonshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04315424229764736078noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post-50405630200286229542016-04-01T16:14:40.295+02:002016-04-01T16:14:40.295+02:00I recognize that every one is different. No 2 peop...I recognize that every one is different. No 2 people will have exactly the same outcome from Hollins as there are other factors that determine your success. Hollins focuses only on the mechanics of fluent speech - but your own emotional aspects cannot be discounted. Personally I had what could be considered a medium disfluency - not sure if there is a more exact way of measuring this. But I have seen worse - and seen way better. Hence my medium assemment. In any case - whether Hollins worked for you or not, I don't believe it should be debunked. I would highly encourage taking the full session and understanding the mechanics of fluent speech. After that, each individual's long term fluency rate will probably vary. But you will know this - that you CAN speak fluently. That is a wonderful feeling.but i do agree that long term success will depend on your individual make up. It's exactly the same as weight loss. There's the mechanics of exercise and initial success. some people keep the weight off. Others regain it. Does not mean joining the gym was a bad ideal. Chetan Chttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16543737617635656372noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post-16831826496620396822016-03-15T10:24:30.585+01:002016-03-15T10:24:30.585+01:00What was your disfluency rate? People who do very ...What was your disfluency rate? People who do very well in the Hollins program had a low disfluency rate. People who Hollins use in their advertising had low disfluency rates. This man"s success is rare. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post-32020489415563425942016-03-12T22:28:23.446+01:002016-03-12T22:28:23.446+01:00Can you tell us what your original rate of disflue...Can you tell us what your original rate of disfluency was? Very successful people in the program had a low disfluency rate.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post-21554438035770828622016-03-12T22:25:57.448+01:002016-03-12T22:25:57.448+01:00Can you tell us what your original rate of disflue...Can you tell us what your original rate of disfluency was? Very successful people in the program had a low disfluency rate. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post-6758253141175524152016-03-10T17:13:00.677+01:002016-03-10T17:13:00.677+01:00What was your original rate of disfluency? Can you...What was your original rate of disfluency? Can you share with us how you practice?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post-11095583179205707102016-03-08T07:31:43.043+01:002016-03-08T07:31:43.043+01:00My experience with Hollins has been life changing....My experience with Hollins has been life changing. I attended Hollins around 1994. I came out completely fluent. I was fluent for 15 years. I practiced my targets every now and then and was able to maintain my fluency. Then I started to lose that discipline because of which I started faultering on some words. Completely my own doing. In 2010 I took a refresher. My fluency returned. As long as I practice my targets and remained disciplined in that, I could maintain complete fluency. whenever I put in a little practice in the morning - on my way to work for example - my day is fantastic. I work in the financial industry - I speak to clients all day, I speak at events to large groups of people. This is the deal - Hollins gave me the tools I needed to be fluent. Anyone who puts in the work and uses the tools will be fluent (just like you were when you were at the center in a controlled environment). I read some of the negative comments here and felt I needed to respond. Hollins made me BELIEVE that I could be fluent. That's all I needed. They rest was up to me. I have to do the work to maintain my fluency. Anyone who was fluent and gets lazy in practice will fall back to their old ways. Please don't put down a program because you did not do the work. I recommend Hollins for two reasons. One - to realize that you CAN be fluent. And two, for the tools that you can carry with you always. I have the audio practices on my iPhone and use whenever I need to. Anyone who has has had a less than successful transfer to the 'real world', please get back to the basics and practice. For the cynics out there - please know that I write this off my own accord. Chetan Chttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16543737617635656372noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post-41788778702323604502015-12-10T17:30:00.302+01:002015-12-10T17:30:00.302+01:00If I were you I would not go to hollins. regardles...If I were you I would not go to hollins. regardless if the therapy works or not, the clinical staff there is very unprofessional. While I was there I overheard two clinicians-Holly and Courtney- talking about how "weird our group was". The other clinician-Cathryn- Never came out of her office and had very little to do with the rest of the clinical staff. I was not the only client that week to hear Holly and Courtney talk negatively about us. I was very repulsed by their words and manner and had I known I was going to be treated in such a distasteful manner I would have never gone. I'm all for getting treatment, but unless you want to be made out as a freak by the clinicians, I wouldn't go to Hollins.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post-3480773064750092612015-10-13T09:48:43.204+02:002015-10-13T09:48:43.204+02:00(American Institute For Stuttering continued): is ...(American Institute For Stuttering continued): is a buffet of all and any techniques for stuttering determined over the past 100 years including a small part of the Hollins program (hey, what the heck!). AIS is actually guilty of false advertising indirectly since one of course assumes that either the people on the Board took one of her programs or that they use techniques that are in the AIS program or that YOU will be able to eventually talk like them. This is not true. One major part of the AIS program is heavy use of Option techniques to reduce the nervousness associated with stuttering. Their effectiveness is questionable. The AIS program is actually a glorification of the Founders personal experiences at the Option Institute where now SHE is the guru of HER Institute. People believe she is wonderful because they believe she has the right idea that stuttering cannot be cured or really controlled and that she is wonderful enough to know that and tell them that which is not exactly true. People love her because she doesn't make them do the unfortunate tuff work which one has to do to control stuttering (which the people on the Board must have done) and gives them recognition for their stuttering problem and "emotional" support for the problem. AIS is a mini Option Institute and monument to the Founder of AIS who had an uncanny knack for charming people of all backgrounds and professions to do things for her like be on her board. The main stuttering technique is RANDOM FLUENCY MANAGEMENT. Go to Hollins and work hardAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post-83359904249702625082015-10-12T14:18:13.575+02:002015-10-12T14:18:13.575+02:00buffet of all and any techniques for stuttering de...buffet of all and any techniques for stuttering determined over the past 100 years including a small part of the Hollins program (hey, what the heck!). AIS is actually guilty of false advertising indirectly since one of course assumes that either the people on the Board took one of her programs or that they use techniques that are in the AIS program or that YOU will be able to eventually talk like them. This is not true. One major part of the AIS program is heavy use of Option techniques to reduce the nervousness associated with stuttering. Their effectiveness is questionable. The AIS program is actually a glorification of the Founders personal experiences at the Option Institute where now SHE is the guru of HER Institute. People believe she is wonderful because they believe she has the right idea that stuttering cannot be cured or really controlled and that she is wonderful enough to know that and tell them that which is not exactly true. People love her because she doesn't make them do the unfortunate tuff work which one has to do to control stuttering (which the people on the Board must have done) and gives them recognition for their stuttering problem and "emotional" support for the problem. AIS is a mini Option Institute and monument to the Founder of AIS who had an uncanny knack for charming people of all backgrounds and professions to do things for her like be on her board. The main stuttering technique is RANDOM FLUENCY MANAGEMENT. Go to Hollins and work hardAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post-44500856380600726762015-10-12T14:14:58.050+02:002015-10-12T14:14:58.050+02:00american institute for stuttering – Do not go here...american institute for stuttering – Do not go here, this ""Institute" does not offer a real stuttering program. The American Institute of Stuttering (AIS) was founded by someone who originally worked for (Professor/Dr.) Ronald Webster of the Hollins Communications Institute in Virginia,a real Institute associated with a University, AIS occupies a few rooms on one floor in downtown Manhattan. The Founder of AIS delivered the Precision Fluency Shaping Program (PFSP) for Ronald Webster in NYC for approx. 8 years until Dr. Webster determined she wasn't delivering it correctly and he fired her. I went to the NYC PFSP in the 80's and knew her. And went back there several times for refreshers. My experience was that she never understood Dr. Webster's stuttering program, she probably never delivered it correctly and she probably was never really interested to deliver it correctly. She was too heavily influenced by her experiences at the Option Institute in Mass. that she heavily attended. The Option Insitute is has a cult like environment led by a charasmatic leader who provides advice on how to be happy and successful using such techniques as "don't judge yourself or others" which you are supposed to do constantly all day long (how practical is that?). With respect to her and Dr. Webster, she was fired as I said and she then started the Total Immersion Fluency Program (a rather bold title don't you think?) using the same information and technique provided by the PFSP without the feedback computer to judge your voice and using this same material in new manuals with her name on it. I took this program and she told me before I came that it was all new material!! She had dropped one PFSP speech target and I trusted her and then I walked around stuttering out of control until I put it back in and then my speech improved. She then continued to change the PFSP program until it was called the American Institute for Stuttering. Our Founder seems to think that she has the "option" to change the speech program she delivers for approx. $4,000 and experiment with people who are hoping to have control over their speech as often as she wants. The American Institute for Stuttering program is yet one more program that the Founder came up with that does not work. But AIS has a board of famous people who stutter whose speech problem was mild in the first place (obviously) who you think is active in the AIS stuttering program providing tips and such but they are not, they are just on the Board for show. The AIS program (continued in next post)........................................................Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post-851907465813301762015-10-11T12:44:59.317+02:002015-10-11T12:44:59.317+02:00I took Ronald Webster"s program 35 years and ...I took Ronald Webster"s program 35 years and have kept up with the changes to his program that included changes to the speech targets that are taught in his program. I have a lot of experience with applying his targets in many different situations and am very well read in psychology and have participated in many therapies of different varieties to help me use the speech targets. My experience has taught me that the people who do well with the Hollins program are those who work hard, are trying to apply the targets consistently and very importantly HAD A LOW DISFLUENCY RATE as measured by Hollins at the beginning of the program. I have researched this and discovered that the people that Hollins puts forward in their ADVERTISING as John Stossel and others had a low disfluency rate. What does this mean? It means that they have an easier time understanding the targets and and easier time applying them. One person who Hollins uses in their advertisement told me that he does not even use all the targets Hollins taught him and he is fluent!! The reason: HE IS MORE RELAXED AND THERE IS LESS TENSION WORKING AGAINST HIM IN USING THE TARGETS. My question to you is: what was your son's disfluency rate as measured by Hollins at the start of the program?? Hollins can tell you this. I will bet it was high. Find out and let us all know here if you want to. This conclusion of mine is of course based on the assumption that your son was able to learn the speech targets and how they work and how they work together. Well hope to hear from you.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post-36846929003636416932015-10-11T12:44:39.460+02:002015-10-11T12:44:39.460+02:00I took Ronald Webster"s program 35 years and ...I took Ronald Webster"s program 35 years and have kept up with the changes to his program that included changes to the speech targets that are taught in his program. I have a lot of experience with applying his targets in many different situations and am very well read in psychology and have participated in many therapies of different varieties to help me use the speech targets. My experience has taught me that the people who do well with the Hollins program are those who work hard, are trying to apply the targets consistently and very importantly HAD A LOW DISFLUENCY RATE as measured by Hollins at the beginning of the program. I have researched this and discovered that the people that Hollins puts forward in their ADVERTISING as John Stossel and others had a low disfluency rate. What does this mean? It means that they have an easier time understanding the targets and and easier time applying them. One person who Hollins uses in their advertisement told me that he does not even use all the targets Hollins taught him and he is fluent!! The reason: HE IS MORE RELAXED AND THERE IS LESS TENSION WORKING AGAINST HIM IN USING THE TARGETS. My question to you is: what was your son's disfluency rate as measured by Hollins at the start of the program?? Hollins can tell you this. I will bet it was high. Find out and let us all know here if you want to. This conclusion of mine is of course based on the assumption that your son was able to learn the speech targets and how they work and how they work together. Well hope to hear from you.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post-49303606795086914372015-10-11T03:54:04.581+02:002015-10-11T03:54:04.581+02:00Consider American Institute for Stuttering in New ...Consider American Institute for Stuttering in New York. They have a very different orientation and approach than Hollins. They have substantially evolved away from a program that focuses on speech techniques, to a more holistic program that focuses on anxiety and avoidance reduction. They offer a three-week intensive program, and also individual therapy, including via Skype.Orahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07560420178241698669noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post-65097501635434494632015-10-10T15:09:13.496+02:002015-10-10T15:09:13.496+02:00My son did Hollins 1 1/2 years ago and I think the...My son did Hollins 1 1/2 years ago and I think the net effect was negative. The tools were hard to employ outside of a clinical setting AND their philosophy that you must not accept your stutter made him feel worse about it. His teacher was not exactly warm and fuzzy and it made it harder for him to reach out for assistance after he left though he would practice on his own. I think they had an obligation to reach out to him and encourage him to use the resources. They disagreed saying the ball was completely in his court. Not unreasonable but, really, was it so hard for them to encourage him a bit? We spent a lot of money. Remember there are travel and hotel costs to consider in addition to the cost of the program. In the end, he feels worse about his speech than ever. I am looking into McGuire but fear another failure will make things worse. At least their primary goal is acceptance and improvement in overall speaking skills, not simply fluency. Any thoughts?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post-69816068350176993392015-01-19T09:12:40.169+01:002015-01-19T09:12:40.169+01:00Regarding my comment from before, my mindset has c...Regarding my comment from before, my mindset has changed. I read a great book called Redefining Stuttering by John C Harrison. There is an article in it that one man wrote about HCRI...if you've been to HCRI, you know it is about HCRI. Article link below. This article struck home with me. Good read if you are considering HCRI as your stuttering therapy choice. Maybe if HCRI focuses more on the whole person - his/her beliefs, perceptions, emotions as well as the mechanical side of things, they might have a chance in the future. Programs like the Mcguire program deal with the whole person and are really gaining ground.<br /><br />http://stuttering-specialist.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/pdf/Ingram-story.pdfTim Steadmannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post-34987962522165455792014-07-28T07:40:25.971+02:002014-07-28T07:40:25.971+02:00There are several obstacles:
1) it costs money.
...There are several obstacles:<br /><br />1) it costs money.<br /><br />2) confidentiality issues.<br /><br />3) impossible to reach them all.<br /><br />4) even if you reach them, how do you measure success?<br /><br />5) some might have done it 5-10 years ago, and might have done anything things in the mean time, so how do you know whether fluency is the cause of something 5-10 years ago?<br />Tom Weidighttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02084153394215001999noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post-67588404783159229362014-07-28T02:54:28.503+02:002014-07-28T02:54:28.503+02:00Why can't an independent agency call graduates...Why can't an independent agency call graduates of hcri to determine long term results? Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12602489.post-44472954571751324752014-04-23T19:56:58.516+02:002014-04-23T19:56:58.516+02:00If you really want to know about the successfulnes...If you really want to know about the successfulness of the Hollins Program, come to one of the reunions they have almost every year in Hollins, VA. They are usually during the second weekend of July. I've been to 4 reunions. Almost everyone at the reunion has low to mild stuttering with a few people still severely stuttering. I myself still stutter enough to say I'm not happy with my progress. I've been through the program and one refresher. If you talk to most of the people at the reunion, most will say they don't practice enough or have stopped practicing all together. I think the long term stats (which are the most important) Hollins posts are correct for those people who do exactly what the center tells you to do...especially after the therapy program....which is call your clinician for help if you are having difficulty, practice daily, call for help, practice daily. The problem is, most people will not do this when they run into trouble. If you are not a tenacious person wanting to do everything you can do to stop stuttering, then the Hollins program probably will not be a long lasting success. You will definitely learn great tools that will help reduce your stuttering, but you will still stutter in the long run.<br /><br />Maybe there should be a disclaimer on HCRI's website that states something like - this is not an easy fix. If you want to attain fluency, you have to work tirelessly during and especially after the program - religiously for months and years to attain sustained fluency. <br /><br />People might work hard enough, but most won't sustain the work ethic long enough for this program to be successful. I being one of those people. <br /><br />It is very much like people who loose a lot of weight quickly through various surgeries or weight loss programs. One life event after another creeps into your life and starts to derail your progress and the pounds start creeping back and eventually you find yourself back where you were.<br /><br />I think the Hollins program is good. It does work for most people initially (it worked for everyone in my group except for 1 participant). Due to human nature, I believe it doesn't live up to its advertised long term stats (the 70-75% number...which by the way, if it was 73%, why not just say 73% or 72% etc?) I'd like to get an auditor to cold call past participants and simply ask them for their full name and to recite the city they live and phone number. I'd bet a sizable donation to Hollins that the stats they advertise on their website will not live up to this audit. I can clearly see and hear this when attending reunions and talking to other past participants. If they don't post these great stats, business probably wouldn't be very good, therefore closing the center and the great research they are conducting. What I can say is most past participants I've talked with are satisfied with the tools they have learned and the tools have helped them in some positive way.<br /><br />Would I do it again, yes. For the month or so after therapy when I was completely and thoughtlessly fluent was one of the best feelings in my life. It is a good high. I did work hard afterwards but life eventually got in the way, disfluency crept in, I got pissed off, and there you go. I didn't reach out for help like I should have. I am not as disfluent as I was and I think that is worth something.Tim Steadmannoreply@blogger.com